80s Camel Mr John Classic Breton Style Hat w/ Feathers
Deep crown with asymmetrically upturned brim. Brim upturns a great deal in the front and very slightly in the back.
Crown is wrapped in a faux pheasant feather.
Inside is finished with a green grosgrain ribbon.
Alley Cats Vintage is a Member of the Vintage Fashion Guild.
Measurements, Size & Fit
Possibly the most important aspect of buying vintage is finding the right fit.
This guide will teach you how to take your measurements and how to determine garment fit.
A few important tips before getting started:
Take your measurements often because your body can change over time.
Many vintage garments are not lined. They were made to be worn with proper undergarments, like slips, girdles, pettipants, long johns, undershirts, etc. Make sure you take your measurements in the undergarments you will be wearing.
Many vintage garments were created in a way that allows altering for a customized fit. Please contact the seller if your measurements are off by just a bit; they can let you know if there is additional seam allowance available. Please consult a professional tailor or seamstress for any alteration questions you may have.
These garments can be fragile, and wearing something that is too tight for you can damage the garment. Keep in mind, if your waist measures 26” and the waist of your garment measures 26” you are going to be squeezed into it! Allow some room to breathe, sit down, eat, sneeze, etc. Be realistic about your measurements and what you find comfortable.
Vintage clothing was often sized much differently than modern clothing. The size tag on the garment may not compare to the same modern size. A vintage size 12 will not necessarily fit a modern size 12. Always go by the measurements provided, not the size marked.
Still unsure if an item will fit you? Measure the clothing you own, pieces you love and wear regularly, the things that fit you the best. Now compare those measurements to the listed measurements of the item you want to buy and to the measurements of your own body.
Sellers will provide as many resources as they can to help, but in the end it is up to you to determine what will work for your body and lifestyle.
How to Measure Your Body & Find Your Actual Measurements
Reminder: Your actual measurements are not the measurements of a garment that will fit you! Please see Determining Fit below.
Already know your measurements? See Determining Fit below.
It is important to know the true measurements of your body. The most reliable way to get this information is to have a professional tailor or seamstress take your measurements. Most people don’t have access to a professional, so we’ve provided instructions for how to measure yourself. It can be difficult to get some of these measurements alone, so we suggest having a friend assist you if possible.
You will need a flexible measuring tape (not a metal tape measure). Don’t have a measuring tape? You can use a piece of string, ribbon, or twine and a yard stick.
Measurements should be taken over bare skin or undergarments. You should not take these measurements over clothing.
Before you get started: Make sure you are wearing the proper undergarments. If you are measuring yourself for a specific dress and you know you will be wearing shapewear under it, measure yourself with the shapewear on. Prefer boxers over briefs? Make sure you are wearing those boxers when you measure yourself.
Let's get started!
Neck or Collar:
This measurement is typically used for men’s dress shirts, but it comes in handy for some women’s clothing too! Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, measure around your neck where a button down shirt collar would lay. Remember not to keep this measurement too tight.
Chest or Bust:
Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, wrap it around the fullest part of your chest, under your arms. Make sure the measuring tape isn’t too tight to take a deep breath, cough or sneeze.
Underbust:
This is a measurement for women’s clothing. Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, wrap the measuring tape around your chest under your bust, exactly where your bra strap would lay.
Bodice:
This is a measurement for women’s clothing. Making sure to lay the measuring tape across the largest part of your bust, measure from your bra strap on top of your shoulder down to your natural waist.
Waist:
This is the natural waist measurement. Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, measure the narrowest part of your waist, below your ribs and above your navel.
Hips:
This measurement is taken at the widest part of your hips. Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, stand with your legs naturally together and measure around the widest part of your hips and buttocks.
Torso:
This is the measurement from shoulder to crotch. Take the measuring tape from the top of your shoulder (next to your neck), all the way down to the center of your crotch (where the seams of pants would meet). Make sure the measuring tape lies across the widest point of your chest.
Rise:
This is not a set measurement and it can vary greatly even on the same person. The rise determines how far pants come up on your waist. Keeping the measuring tape perpendicular to the floor, measure from the center of your crotch (where pants seams meet) up toward your naval. This is typically used to determine fit more often than to define a body measurement.
Back Rise:
This is not a set measurement and it can vary greatly even on the same person. The rise determines how far pants come up on your waist and the back rise helps determine how much room you will need in the seat. Keeping the measuring tape perpendicular to the floor, measure from the center of your crotch (where pants seams meet) up over the largest part of your buttocks, to the natural waist. This is typically used to determine fit more often than to define a body measurement.
Inseam:
The inseam is the measurement of your inner leg. Keeping the measuring tape perpendicular to the floor and your legs standing naturally together, hold one end of the tape at the highest point of your inner thigh and measure to the ground.
Outseam:
Your outseam is the measurement of your outer leg. Keeping the measuring tape perpendicular to the floor, measure from your natural waist to the floor on the outside of your leg.
Arm:
Stand with your arms relaxed at your side. Measure from the top of your shoulder to your wrist.
Sleeve:
This measurement is typically used only on men’s dress shirts. Measure from your spine at the back of your neck, to the edge of your shoulder. Follow your arm down along the bend of your elbow to just below the wrist where you would want a shirt-cuff to sit. Bend your elbow a bit more than usual to allow for ease.
Bicep or Upper Arm:
Measure the largest part of your upper arm while flexing.
Wrist:
Measure the smallest part of your wrist.
Thigh:
Keeping the measuring tape parallel to the floor, stand with your legs slightly apart and measure the top of your thigh at the widest part.
Reminder: Now that you know your body’s dimensions, remember - your actual measurements are not the measurements of a garment that will fit you!
Please see Determining Size & Fit in the next section.
Determining Size and Fit
You must know the measurements of your body before using this guide. If you do not know your measurements yet, please see Finding Your Actual Measurements/How to Measure Your Body in the previous section.
Determining fit is subjective. Everyone has different preferences, personal style and lifestyle needs. This guide will give you the basics, but in the end this is a personal decision that you will need to make. New to buying pre-owned? It may take some trial and error and that’s ok! We’ve all been there. It can take a few tries to find your footing, but once you do there will be endless offerings of unique fashion out there to discover.
What is “Ease”: Ease is the amount of room you have between your actual body measurement and the clothing you wear. It is extremely important to know what ease is and how much you prefer when trying to determine garment fit.
Know how and where you will be wearing these garments. Are you going on a fancy dinner date or are you going to a bonfire? Will you be sitting quietly or playing touch football? These things matter when determining fit! If you know you like to be active or may need to move a lot when wearing these clothes, take that into account and allow for extra ease.
Find a Good Tailor or Seamstress: Vintage garments were made to be tailored to fit. Having a professional available can help perfect the fit when you receive your garment.
Let's get started!
Neck or Collar:
You should allow a minimum of 0.5” of ease between your neck measurement and the collar of your garment. This will give you a traditional dress shirt collar fit. If you desire more room, take that into account when viewing measurements.
Chest or Bust:
Allow enough ease for a deep breath, cough or sneeze. Are you buying a sweater that you will layer over a shirt? Looking at a blouse that fits loosely at the bust? Keep in mind the style of the garments and how it will be worn, and make sure to allow for ease.
General rule of thumb is to allow:
1” of ease for suit vests
2” of ease for blazers and suit jackets
4” of ease for outerwear jackets (like jean jackets)
6” of ease for outerwear coats
Underbust:
For garments that have a tight underbust, sellers will provide this measurement. If you wear these items too tightly, you will pop a seam if you sneeze.
Empire Waist:
An empire waist will typically fall near the underbust. Use your underbust measurement to determine fit.
Bodice:
This measurement is very important, especially if you have a torso that is longer or shorter than average. It will help you to determine fit for items that have a fitted and defined waist. Use this measurement to determine where the waist will land on your body.
Waist:
When you see a waist measurement for a garment, it may not correspond to your natural waist measurement. You may need to use a combination of measurements to determine fit. Pants are a great example of this. Use the rise measurement to determine where the waist of the pants will sit, then measure your waist at that point.
Hips:
Leave a minimum of 2” of ease. Take into account bending over, sitting, walking up stairs, etc. Garment hip measurements are typically taken 9-10” below the garment’s waist measurement. Remember that vintage pants did not usually have stretch like most modern pants do. Use the style of the garment to help determine fit. Is it a pull on style with no waist opening? You may need to fit your hips through the waist to pull it on.
Torso:
This measurement will help you to determine if a one piece style garment like a bodysuit, swimsuit, jumpsuit or coveralls will fit. Make sure to account for enough ease to bend over and sit down without hurting yourself. Items that are too tight in the torso will pull up the crotch seam making for a very uncomfortable experience.
Rise:
The rise determines where the waist of the pants will rest on your body at the front. Measure this distance on your own body, from the center of your crotch (where pants seams meet) up toward your naval. When you reach the right rise, measure your waist at that point. This will help determine where the pants waist will sit when worn and if the pants waist will fit.
Back Rise:
The back rise determines where the waist of the pants will rest on your body at the back. This is a very important measurement to know as it will help you determine if the pants will fit your butt. Measure this distance on your own body, from the center of your crotch (where pants seams meet) up, across the largest part of your buttocks. When you reach the right rise, measure your waist at that point. This will help determine where the pants waist will sit when worn and if the pants waist and butt will fit.
Inseam & Outseam:
When using an inseam or outseam measurement to determine fit, make sure to take into account the shoes you will be wearing and where you want the hem of the pants to fall. If you want to buy tapered or cropped pants, you will need pants with inseam/outseams that measure shorter than your own. Wearing platforms and want bell bottoms that hit the floor? Measure your inseam and outseam while wearing those shoes to determine where the hem will fall.
Shoulder to Cuff or Collar to Cuff.
This measurement measures the sleeve of garments and the sleeve only. Most items will have a shoulder seam and the sleeve will be measured from shoulder seam to the end of the cuff. Some items will have batwing or raglan sleeves with no shoulder seam, so they will be measured from the edge of the collar to the end of the cuff. Keep in mind, full sleeves like bishop or balloon sleeves may measure quite long, due to the extra fabric used to create fullness, but will usually have a fitted cuff to keep the wrist in place.
Sleeve:
This measurement is typically used only on men’s dress shirts. Make sure to allow for enough ease to bend and use your arms.
Bicep or Upper Arm:
Leave enough ease in sleeves so you don’t tear the fabric when flexing. This may not seem like a big deal, but if your sleeves are tight and you lift a child, pull open a heavy door or carry a heavy bag, you may pop a seam!
Wrist:
Leave enough ease that you don’t lose circulation. Many cuffs are adjustable by moving a button or snap. If this measurement is close, contact the seller to see if alteration is possible.
Thigh:
Know your limits! If your pants are too tight and you squat down to pick something up, you might have a seam blowout. Leave enough ease to bend over, climb stairs, and sit comfortably.
Guide to Buying Vintage & Pre-Owned Fashion
Unique, affordable, sustainable.
The Listing
Don’t hesitate:
In most cases, there is only one of these items available. If you love it, buy it. There might not be another chance.
Size:
The listed size is always an estimate. It is the buyer’s responsibility to use the measurements provided to determine fit. Sellers will do the best they can to approximate size, but no two bodies are the same and sellers cannot be certain of size or fit. If you ask a seller to help you determine the size or fit of an item, their response is not a guarantee.
Garments may be clipped or pinned:
Not all garments will fit the seller’s dress forms, mannequins or models. These items may be pinned or clipped to show proper fit.
Accessories may not be included:
Garments may be shown with crinolines, hoops, slips, belts or other items that are not included in the sale. If you have questions about what is included, please reach out to the seller directly.
Color:
Garment color may not appear in listings exactly the way it looks in person. Photo lighting and displays can alter color significantly. Please, do not pressure our sellers to commit to a specific hue prior to purchase, describing a color is subjective and the seller cannot guarantee that their interpretation matches yours.
Making an Offer:
Fashion Conservatory is not a flea market. If the price is marked “Firm” it is not ok to make an offer. If a price is not marked “Firm” you can politely ask a seller if they are open to offers, what is the best price they would accept or make a reasonable offer (no more than 15% off). Lowball offers are not permitted and sending a message with just a dollar amount is considered harrassment. Our sellers are free to ask any price they wish and insulting a seller regarding price, item or model is strictly prohibited. Always be polite. Always.
Most purchases are final sale and not returnable:
Return options will be specified in the listing, but the option to return is going to be rare. Many of the sellers on Fashion Conservatory are small, one person operations. Items are unique and many are delicate. Accepting returns is a huge financial risk that small sellers just can’t afford to take. This is why our return policies are strict. Please read the entire description of the item and all of Fashion Conservatory’s policies prior to purchase. Link to return policy
Asking a question:
Make sure to ask all questions prior to purchase. If you message a seller, please be specific and ask all of your questions in one message. If you send a different message for each question, your additional questions may get lost in the shuffle. Keeping everything in a single message thread will make communication much easier.
The price:
The price listed is for the item only and does not include shipping or taxes. Please be aware that if you live outside of the United States there may be import taxes and/or VAT that need to be paid before your item can be delivered.
Shipping cost:
Most of our sellers are small, one person operations that cannot afford to offer free shipping. Building the cost of shipping into the price of the item is not fair to their overseas buyers and Fashion Conservatory requests that you do not pressure sellers to offer shipping for free. Free shipping is never free for the seller.
The Perfect Fit
It is the buyer’s responsibility to estimate fit:
Sizing and fit can vary greatly depending on taste, personal style and lifestyle.
We provide information to help buyers determine measurements, size and fit here: Measurements, Size & Fit (link)
Know your measurements:
This is the most important aspect of buying clothing online. Know the measurements of your body and know the measurements of your favorite garments.
Fabric content and stretch:
Modern clothing is typically stretchy, eliminating the need for additional ease or tailoring. Garments made pre-2000 were not made in this fashion. This is especially true of jeans. Do not expect vintage garments to stretch unless noted in the item description.
Find a tailor:
Proper tailoring can make an item look like it was made for you. If the measurements are off by just a bit, tailoring may be an option. Be sure to ask your seller about seam allowance, textile type, or any other details your tailor might need, prior to purchase. Sellers will answer questions to the best of their ability, but they cannot be held responsible for failed alteration attempts. It is the buyer’s responsibility to speak with their tailor regarding the viability of alterations.
Not everything can be altered to fit:
Please keep in mind, there are certain garments that cannot be altered in a way that allows them to fit and no seller can guarantee that a garment is, or is not, alterable. Maybe the torso is too long, there is no additional seam allowance, the textile will show old seam marks, or any other number of other reasons. This is why it is important to speak with the seller and your tailor prior to purchase. They should be able to provide enough information for you to make a decision.
A Gentle Reminder
Expect Imperfection:
When you buy vintage clothing, you are buying an item that has already lived a life. The little signs of use and small flaws are part of why we love vintage, these imperfections add charm and character. Each piece has a story to tell and as the new owner you get to add your own chapter. Understanding and embracing the idea that things won’t be perfect is a necessary step of becoming a vintage fashion owner.
Age:
The older the item, the more care should be taken when wearing and storing it. This is especially true with laces, silks, velvets and furs. Items older than 1940 should be handled and worn with extreme care, they should never be used for a costume or performance.
Undergarments:
Every era has a preferred silhouette. When buying vintage clothing, it’s important to understand the silhouette of the era and to buy the appropriate undergarments. This will help with proper fit and comfort while wearing.
One of a Kind:
Many vintage items were not made to be one of a kind, but enough time has passed, and so many pieces have been lost, that it is rare you will run into another person who owns the same vintage piece that you do. The older the item the more rare it is to find another like it.
Sustainability:
Buying vintage and pre-owned clothing is one of, if not the most, sustainable way to buy fashion. Using the clothing that’s already here to expand your wardrobe is an ethical choice. Many of these items have been around for at least 30 years; if properly cared for they can last for decades to come.
Looking for more? Check out the Fashion Conservatory Guide to Owning & Caring for Vintage Fashion
Condition Chart
Mint: Pristine with no signs of being used, stored or worn.*
Excellent: No notable flaws, may show minor signs of use or storage.
Very Good: Minor flaws that do not affect the overall look or wearability of the product
Good: Strong and wearable with issues that affect the overall look of the product
Fair: Barely wearable, could be used for a photoshoot, display, costume, study, etc.
Poor: Not wearable. Could be used for repurposing, study or pattern.
Deadstock: These items are unused and often have original tags and/or packaging. These are vintage items that were either never sold or never worn. These items can have dust marks, odors, fading, rust stains from pins and/or other issues from decades of storage. All visible flaws will be noted within the listing, but be aware that folded or packaged items can have issues that are not visible. If you are buying these items to wear, they should be cleaned before use. Deadstock items are non-returnable.
*Please, be aware that pre-owned and/or vintage fashion will always show some evidence of its past. If you are looking for fashion items with zero signs of a previous life, pre-owned and/or vintage fashion may not be the right choice for you.
Size Charts
All Fashion Conservatory Sellers Use The Size Charts Below.
- Items are listed with the approximate size of the person they will fit. This is for search purposes only and is not a guarantee of fit.
- Sellers are not able to estimate your size or how a garment will fit you. It is the responsibility of the buyer to know their own measurements and to understand what works well for them.
- To estimate the size of certain garments that require a large amount of ease, sellers take the actual chest measurement of the garment, then subtract inches off of the chest measurement of the garment to determine a size.
- Blazers: minus 2"
- Outerwear Jackets: minus 4"
- Outerwear Coats: minus 6"
The measurements below represent the size of a person, not the size of a garment.
All measurements below are in inches.
Women's Sizing
Displayed as Bust/Waist/Hips
XXS - up to 31/23/31
XS - 32/24/32 to 33/25/33
Small - 34/26/34 to 35/27/35
Medium - 36/28/36 to 37/29/37
Large - 38/30/38 to 39/31/39
XL - 40/32/40 to 42/33/42
XXL - 43/34/43 to 46/37/46
3XL - 47/38/47 to 50/42/50
Men's Sizing
Displayed as Chest/Waist
XXS -up to 32/26
XS - 33/27 to 34/28
Small - 35/29 to 37/31
Medium - 38/32 to 40/34
Large - 41/35 to 44/38
XL - 45/39 to 48/42
XXL - 49/43 to 52/46
3XL - 53/47 to 56/52
Men’s Suit Jacket Length:
Short - up to 29.75"
Regular - 30" to 30.75"
Long - 31" or longer
Cancellations & Returns
Cancellations:
You must contact the seller directly to cancel an order.
Orders cancelled prior to shipment can incur a 10% cancellation fee.
If a shipping label has been printed, the order can no longer be cancelled.
Orders that have been shipped may be processed through returns only if the product is eligible.
Returns:
If any of the following three statements are true, the item is not returnable:
If the listing says “Returnable: No”
If this item will be shipped outside of the United States
If this item is purchased with foreign currency
If all three of the following are true, the item is returnable:
The listing says “Returnable: Yes”
The item is purchased with US dollars
The item will be shipped within the United States
In a nutshell:
All returns are subject to a 15% restocking fee.
Fashion Conservatory must be contacted within 48hrs of item receipt for a RMA.
Returns must be scanned by USPS within 3 days of RMA receipt.
Items returned without a RMA will not be refunded.
To Return an Item
Step 1:
Within 48 hours of item receipt, the buyer must contact Fashion Conservatory here, with a reason for return. If the return is approved, the buyer will receive a Return Merchandise Authorization (RMA).
Step 2:
Returns must be shipped back via USPS priority mail with tracking information at the customer’s expense. Return shipment must be confirmed by USPS as shipped back to the seller within 3 days of RMA receipt. A tracking number must be provided to Fashion Conservatory at time of return.
Step 3:
When the Seller receives the item, they will notify the Buyer. The item will be refunded, less a 15% restocking fee, within 5 business days.
Additional Buyer Requirements
Buyer assumes all responsibility for return shipments. Package the item carefully so it is not damaged during shipment.
Items valued at $300 or more must be insured for the full purchase price. Fashion Conservatory strongly suggests insuring items valued at $299 or less.
Refunds will be given for merchandise only, less a 15% restocking fee. Buyer is responsible for all shipping fees.
Returns must be received in the same condition as they were originally sent. Any and all tags must be attached and accessories must be included.
For more details, please see the Fashion Conservatory Community Requirements
- Navigation: Please use the tabs above to access helpful information like size charts, condition charts, and return policies.
- Condition: Items may show minor signs of use or storage. All notable flaws will be mentioned in the Condition Details section of each listing. Condition Chart
- Size & Fit: It is the buyer’s responsibility to use the measurements provided to determine fit. Sizing and fit are subjective and depend on personal preference. All sizes in item titles and item descriptions are approximate. See the Size & Fit Guide for details.
- Color: Due to variations between monitors actual garment color may not be exactly as it appears in images.
- Accessories & Styling: Garments may be clipped, pinned and/or accessorized on forms and models to show proper fit and style. Accessories are not included unless otherwise stated, including, but not limited to: crinolines, slips, belts and jewelry.
- Combined Shipping: If you would like combined shipping, items must be purchased at the same time and have the same ship-to address.
- Special Requests: If you have special requests, you must confirm them with the seller prior to purchase. Special requests made after purchase may not be available or applied.
- International Customers: Import duties, taxes and charges are not included in the purchase price or shipping cost. These charges are the responsibility of the buyer. Falsifying customs documents is illegal and asking a seller to commit customs fraud by lowering the purchase price on customs forms is strictly prohibited.
